SPEAKER_02 0:00

Everyone has a story, a moment, a lesson, or a piece of their life most people may never hear. Hi, I'm Callie Zamzo, and this is Nobody Knows. Welcome back to Nobody Knows. I'm uh I'm really excited about today's conversation. Um for generations, kids have learned by exploring and learning um with by the world around them, just kind of by getting out into, you know, climbing trees and playing in the dirt and, you know, doing doing the things that I know that I did as a kid, built forts. There was always a fort to be built, that sort of thing. Um children seem to have more information now than they ever have before. Um, but it seems like we're having more conversations around things like kindergarten readiness and um distractions and um not being able to focus and things like that. And um, so so I'm I'm curious about you know what children actually need to thrive in in today's world. And so today we're exploring that. We're doing that with Ada Page. She is this is interesting. So she I have that she is the education director for the Children's Museum of Idaho. However, welcome to the studio. I think you have you're telling to tell us that something has changed.

SPEAKER_00 1:17

Well, thank you so much for having me, Callie. I've been very excited for this opportunity coming here, getting to meet you. I had never met you in person before, but I felt like I did. Your name is often used in the museum because SAMSO's is a very big part of why we're able to do what we do, and you've been big supporters since day one of the museum. So I wanted to thank you for that first. And um, if I'm a little nervous, I I ask for forgiveness, but it's been a very exciting couple weeks, and I just received the news this morning, so it's fresh off the press that I have been offered the position of executive director at the museum. It's awesome. It is, I'm very, very excited. Um even being the education director, just working at the museum is a dream come true. I've been a lifelong educator. So it's I've expressed this. Um the fact that I get to continue to build on the strong foundation that is there. It is such a special place that I get to walk through every day. I mean, at the my first couple of weeks, Sarah would pinch myself. I'm like, I cannot believe this is my work setting.

SPEAKER_02 2:33

Yeah, I it's such a it's a very cool place. And I it's funny because I think a lot of times if people don't have small children, um they haven't been there, they don't, they haven't walked through it. I encourage people to now you have to, if I remember correctly, you have to have a child with you, right?

SPEAKER_00 2:48

You are you allowed to go if you're you are not allowed to go during regular business hours if you do not have a child. Every child needs an adult and every adult needs a child. However, and I wasn't here for advertising, um, the museum is available to rent out after hours. So you can have corporate events. It is a very, very fun place. We're currently working on creating adult date nights. I'm working on an um space themed, and we will use our planetarium for that. So we're very excited about that.

SPEAKER_02 3:19

Yeah, and the it is it for those of us who uh I think grew up imagining a place like the Children's Museum. We didn't have anything like that when we were kids. When you walk in as an adult, it's mesmerizing. And it's not mesmerizing because it's a whole bunch of electronics. It's elect it's it's it's amazing because it's hands-on, fun. I mean, there's a there's a ship that you can climb up on and like and pretend to be a pirate. And um you there's a a spaceship, yeah, rocket ship, exactly. There's uh building blocks. There's uh, you know, and then of course, like you have the, I guess you can probably go further into this. Like, what are some of the other um exhibits that that happened right now?

SPEAKER_00 4:01

It is such a fun place. And I I'll touch on the exhibits, but I don't you mentioned as an adult walking through. We were recently at Dairy Day's parade, and I was riding in the van with Jan, which I do wanna um talk about her a bit later. But um the kids when they would see the van, and you expect that from the kids, and when we're out at events in the community and we have our retractable, they're like, I've been there. I like, yeah, I love the pirate ship. I they all love Trader Joe's. Oh, yeah. I think that's a that's a crowd favorite. We have Idaho pizza. I mean, it's a very fun place. But for me, going through the Dairy Days Parade, you expect the kids to recognize it and and shout out in excitement. What surprised me the most was the adults. And we're going, the parade route is about an hour, so we're we're moving along. And every time we inch forward, you would hear the adults, oh, the children's museum. We love that place. And they were equally, if not more excited than the kids. And that that was really, really stood out for me. So it is um, it's a wonderful place. It is actually when you walk in, it can be a bit overwhelming because you're just taken back the first time you walk through it. Um, we have we're constantly enhancing our exhibits as well, so there's always something new. We added, it's been two years now, an additional 4,000 square feet. So we have in the new, in the new edition, we have a K T TV um studio. We have a green room, a news desk where the kids can actually become the reporters. They put on the coats and you they see themselves on the on the TV. We have a magnificent planetarium. Um, like you said, we have the rocket ship, we have an airplane, we have a toddler town, we have a spectacular water table outside that um it's a replica of the Boise River, and the children can move the water flow, they can fish and they can move the water flow and see, they can dam it. It's it's just very, very neat. We have our Samsos barn outside. Yes, yes. We have a new exhibit just opening today, which is a tractor run. We have our gravity car racers, and this is separate from that. Um, they have fun tractors, and they get to um use those in different um terrains. It can go through snow, it can go through hills. That's cool, very exciting. Yeah, we have our chicken hatchery. We actually have live chickens in the back. We have these ginormous blue building blocks, which is fun to see children and parents interacting. Yeah, they could do almost life how life-size houses, marble runs. Um, I can go on and on. It's just it's the most magical place.

SPEAKER_02 6:55

It really is. And um, so yeah, so so for those people who have not been there, um, it's in Meridian and it's a great place to go.

SPEAKER_00 7:01

You are right off the Meridian exit. So it's very close and accessible for everybody in the treasure valley.

SPEAKER_02 7:08

It's also a great gift. I've uh for people in my life who have younger children, I love to give that as like a Christmas gift or birthday gift because it's just it's mesmerizing. And then when people actually go there for the first time, they can't believe it, you know. Like, wow, I can't, because a lot of people don't realize still that we have this wonderful resource. So yeah, it's pretty great.

SPEAKER_00 7:26

And we do have, I know it's still a little bit out, but um, for you mentioned gifts for gifts, our memberships during um Black Friday. We run a big promotion that people wait for all year, where if you buy the membership, you get an additional alternate adult. So it doesn't just have to be mom or dad. If you have an alternate adult in your membership, you that could rotate of who you bring. You can bring grandma, and we include that for free during that Black Friday sale. Normally, that's a $75 add-on. So that's very cool.

SPEAKER_02 7:58

And that's a good reminder, too, because I think a lot of times, you know, it's fun if you are regularly going with mom and then all of a sudden grandma gets to come. You get to now as the kid, you get to share with grandma all the stuff, and these are the things and it's it's so neat and exciting.

SPEAKER_00 8:10

Very good. And going back to the museum, I'm sorry. I don't want to go on and on, but I am just that's what we're here for. My my children are adult children now. We um they grew up in Miami and we had a children's museum, and it was very exciting. It opened about the time that they were four and five. So we became members at the children's museum and it offered a lot of what we do. We didn't have a Trader Joe's, we had a Publix, and that was always fun. But um, one thing that's been interesting to me about the children's museum here and what we do differently is kids love make pretend play. Yes. And our children's museum didn't in back in Florida, didn't have as much as that. We had a different place that was in for Lauderdale and Miami traffic. It was a good hour and a half to get there that was called Wannabe City. And Wannabe City was a replica of a real city for children, children's eyes. And they had its own fire station, its own doctor's office, its own dentist's office. And those are some of the exhibits that we do. So I feel our museum combines both of those. Yeah, I mean, you see, the we have a vet's office. Yes, and that is a highlight. I you can see them. And sometimes we have the animals in cages and they take them out and they have the x-rays and they do all these things. And sometimes I walk by and I mistake the animals for real animals. Like, does somebody bring in a dog? Because the kids are actually treating them like if they were carrying them like if it was their pet. So I think it's it's there's no other word than a magical place.

SPEAKER_02 9:46

Yeah, absolutely. Okay, well, let's uh let's dive in here. I I I have a a starting question for you here. What do you think that kids need most right now that they're not getting enough of?

SPEAKER_00 9:58

Experiences, the ability to um interact with others and being placed in situations where they can problem solve situations that spark their curiosity that lead them to ask questions. I I think that and that applies to all ages. Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 10:23

Are there trends that are worrying you right now for with with kids?

SPEAKER_00 10:28

Well, trends with kids or trends in education. Well, by either either one. And I think I used to refer to my own uh kids, and I said they are now young adults as the heads-down generation. And I think that is it's been going on for a couple of years now. I don't think it's a new trend, but how attached, not just kids, just everybody is to their screens. Yeah. I mean, I I sometimes leave my phone behind at home as you're running out the door, and I don't make it past my driveway. Yeah. Because the minute you're pulling out, you're looking for it. Um, so I think that is concerning in general for everyone. And yes, things everything has pros and cons, and there is tons of benefits to the technology that we're using nowadays, but I would say it is concerning to see what we're losing, what kids are losing from that.

SPEAKER_02 11:32

Yeah. It is interesting. I my daughter and I went on a river trip the other day, and neither one of us had any place to put our phones that were getting to keep them safe, so we had to leave them in the car. And I noticed that both of us, now, once we kind of separated from and got out on the river, it didn't even think about it. Like if we've had a wonderful time and didn't even think about it. And we even got in the car, and both of us were didn't even, it wasn't the first thing we grabbed for either. So it was interesting to get away from it for a second. But it is an interesting thing, just that the this trend that we are it's almost like a fidget. Like we'd have to be looking for the phone constantly and doing that. And um, and and it's happening with younger and younger children. That's that's what I'm noticing is that it's it's a it's a babysitter sometimes.

SPEAKER_00 12:12

It's amazing to see one-year-olds grab the phone and actually open the screen and find the app that they're used to. Like I think it's getting younger and younger. Um, but going as back to the phone conversation, my daughter back in college worked at a sleepawake camp. So it's not only the kids, and she was excited about this experience. We were excited for her, but I was having, I was like, wait, you need to not have I can't communicate with you. We've gotten so used to that instant gratification because they were not allowed their phones, even as counselors. And she was nervous, how is she gonna go an entire week? They only got it on their um day off. Yeah, so it was six days, no access to the phone. And after that first summer, she got back. And the first thing she said, she's like, I loved it. I can't wait to go back next year to not have my phone and not have to respond to people. So it was very interesting to see that.

SPEAKER_02 13:19

I I first experienced that when my my daughter would uh went offship, they camped for a week. So it's through her school and definite, they were off the grid. So even if she wanted, if she wanted to turn her phone up, they were off the grid. They literally couldn't have any service. And uh, and that it was anxiety causing for me and her. But then after it was kind of interesting. If you get to the end of the week, you're like, oh, wait, that's doable. And then I forget that that's how it was when I grew up, how quickly we have have turned in the society that are constantly connected and we don't really need to be. Absolutely.

SPEAKER_00 13:48

The other interesting takeaway from that experience is the friendships that she made. Oh, yeah. So she is probably she made some great friendships in college as well, but these were just made over summer and they're lasting, impactful friendship because the time that they spent together without the distraction of screens solidified those bonds.

SPEAKER_02 14:11

So I I think that lends itself to the question of what happens if we ignore this screen time thing, if we don't go off to camp for a week and turn our phones off and experience that? What happens to those kids that are nonstop and that don't have that ability or somebody in their life who says, nope, we're gonna take that away and we're gonna do something real for a little while. What is the trend do you think that might happen with our kids?

SPEAKER_00 14:35

I think learning gains would be enormous. The just the satisfaction. We're talking about positive experiences, just you on your um river floating trip and Victoria's summer. Um imagine if we parents made an effort to do that. It's very difficult. It's easier done when you're put in the situation that you have no choice. Right when you're making a conscious effort to do that, it's a little more difficult. Um, it'd be very interesting. I'm sure there's some studies out there, but they're in controlled settings. But to see the results, if we had metrics to be able to assess that, I can guarantee, I mean, so many. Um the State of Our Kid report was just released, and that was one of the topics in there. So I started screen time and the negative effects that it's having on children. Um, we're talking about trends in in education, just like in everything else, you know, trends come and go. And several years ago, I mean time goes by so fast. I don't know. I'm trying to remember how long ago it was. I was, and teachers are notorious for not liking change. I think all humans have a hard time. Change is difficult, it pushes us out of our comfort zone. But I was in a school when the one-to-one device trend was happening. And, you know, as a as a leader, you always have to encourage and you know, have people be open-minded and try new things and accept this. And I'm not gonna lie, I was very hesitant myself. I think that was one of those fake it to you make it moments because I was cringing inside, but I said, I have to, you know, practice what I preach and be open-minded to this. And we transitioned the elementary school to one-on-one devices. We got rid of textbooks.

SPEAKER_02 16:37

Wow.

SPEAKER_00 16:38

I mean, I said I'm a lifelong educator. We love tangible things. There's nothing like highlighting a book, like physically moving the pages, but math. I'm like a lot of the math books were workbooks and consumables, even in the upper grades, because you get to see the problem, you have the formula, it's tangible. So that was interesting. Again, the kids took to it very quickly. Um, and that's the trend. And that's what all the schools were doing. And if you weren't doing it, you were staying behind. Right. But then there were schools that stood their ground and didn't. Um very, very I mean um prestigious prep school said, no, we're not doing this. And guess what? Their enrollment increased because they were offering something that others weren't. And within time, yes, we still have the devices and we use them, but schools I've been following that. Some schools are returning to actual textbooks.

SPEAKER_02 17:44

And definitely I think we're seeing more and more delaying it, which I think lends us to the the the discussion of uh kindergarten preparedness and being ready for kindergarten. So I remember as a little girl that there were certain things that we did at home, knowing that I was getting ready for kindergarten and I there were some things that I needed to understand and needed to know, and and that obviously that was not happening on a computer. That was happening with my parents just interacting with me to make sure that I was up to speed on certain things. Um, kids entering kindergarten are much less prepared now, generally speaking, not all of them, obviously, but there is kind of an alarming trend there that the disdain lies.

SPEAKER_00 18:21

And there's things that are often missed. We're talking about this increased screen time that decreases eye-hand coordination, like tying your shoes. I mean, I again I've been in elementary schools my my entire career. Kids were by first grade, you expected them to know how to tie their shoes. Now it's not uncommon to see third grader, fourth graders. I've been out at Rhesus, they're running around with their laces untied, and I ask them to tie them so that they don't trip, and they look at me like, can you tie it for me?

SPEAKER_02 18:54

Wow.

SPEAKER_00 18:55

So these are little things that we don't we're not necessarily conscious of if you're not paying attention to, but oh my gosh. They are. I think the inner like the parent-child interaction. I know we're living in a biz busy times. Everybody has a lot on their plates, and like you mentioned, the screens sometimes become a babysitter or parents they're watching an educational show, so you feel comfortable with that, but you're missing out on so much.

SPEAKER_02 19:28

Yeah, absolutely. I I I wonder also about like social skills. Are there is that part of part of what you're seeing as well?

SPEAKER_00 19:36

So much, which is why we take pride in what we do at the museum, because they're, like I said, putting them in these situations that they have to collaborate, that they have to problem solve, that they have to interact with others. And we do a lot of um special programs that are included with the admission where kids we do story time and they have to do a craft, and sometimes they have to collaborate to to create this because they don't and then it causes so many behavior issues in the classroom because they are lacking these social skills, they don't know how to communicate with their friend or set boundaries or say, I don't like that. They just um clam up.

SPEAKER_02 20:22

Yeah. Oh, and along that same line, it seems like there, I mean, we never used to talk about mental health in elementary school. Like that was something we began to like you go into pre-pubes and then pub and then, yes, of course, we get all that. But you're hearing it more and more in young, in children who who are beginning to have just social anxieties and things like that earlier and earlier.

SPEAKER_00 20:45

And which I has it I I don't know what else to attribute it to than oh no, they're they are linking it in the report that I mentioned does um dive into that. It's a sense of loneliness. Yeah. They don't know how to identify it as loneliness at that time, but they spend so much time one-on-one with the screen that you start to feel that loneliness and they don't know how to express it at that age.

SPEAKER_02 21:11

You know, it's funny, this is confessing a little bit here. I I've had times when I it was quiet time and I got on my phone and I started doom scrolling. And you feel different after a session of that. Even if you're spending 15 minutes and you lose yourself, and then you're like, what am I doing? I gotta get afterwards, you kind of feel off. Like not only are your eyes a little bit blurry because you've been looking at your phone, but literally you're like the brain isn't functioning. It's like it's almost like you have to step out of that world and then like shake it off and do something different and re-engage with the world in order to even shake it off. And I'm an adult, so I can't I went kids who don't reason like we do, and they're still learning all that, and they're still forming synapses as fast as you can, you know, blink. I I don't know what that's doing. Is that rewinding? Their brains in such a way that is going to be detrimental in the future.

SPEAKER_00 22:03

Absolutely. I'm guilty of that as well as an adult. And to piggyback on that, how guilty do you feel? Because once you go down that rabbit hole, you get lost, and you thought you were going to look at it for five minutes, and then you've wasted 45 minutes, and then you feel guilty that you just wasted that 45 minutes. So yeah, it's it's negative effects. And as far as kids, um, think back to when we were growing up with the gaming councils like Atari, and and that was a concern. And how controlled was that? You only had access to it, and how difficult was it to use? And then we moved on to the Game Boys and the Nintendo's, and still that was it at the child's um, they couldn't access that all the time. They couldn't take that to school. And we were talking about the negative effects that had back then. Now imagine everybody has an iPad, everybody has an iPhone. I mean, our society doesn't function without it.

SPEAKER_02 23:02

Absolutely. Well, and just stepping uh a little bit into the teens, I was the mom who held out and didn't let my kid have a phone. She's the last one in her class. And socially, it it was horrible for her. They were all on Snapchat and they were all having these conversations and she was cut out of all of them. And they really ridiculed her and persecuted her because she didn't have a phone. And man, it was hard as her mom to hold tight. And even then, like I let her have it when she went to high school, because then like she was gonna be writing with friends and that. And so I thought, okay, we can now we can. I wish I'd have held off even longer. I gotta be honest with you.

SPEAKER_00 23:35

I know that is what I did that as well. And then you question, you begin to doubt yourself. Am I we know we're doing it for a good reason, but then you're like, when they're excluded socially, you're like, Am I causing more harm than good? What is the right time? And that's a question parents always ask, and it's a very personal one. It's hard to be the one not allowing it when the majority is what the benefits are. Um, my niece has it's an unusual situation. She has a 13-year-old who's been in college now for two years. It's a little bit of a doogie houser. I'm not bragging. Again, everything they've faced challenges. Fortunately, she was an educator and has been able to navigate it. But she held off on giving him his. She's a firm believer. Again, being an educator and seeing the effects. She was a middle school principal. I mean, she was a high school math and English teacher in the middle school, so she saw terrible, terrible things with cell phones from the school setting. So she was adamant about this. And she's taking her 11-year-old to college that she's worked through a lot. And she would drive him, he would go into class and she would sit outside. Well, she didn't think that in class they have double, he had the watch that's safe that you can talk to the parent, but they have double authentication to be able to get into things. So he comes out of class and he's like, Mom, I couldn't do anything. I needed a code on my phone. And so she had to work through that.

SPEAKER_02 25:09

Interesting. Yeah, that is a unique situation because yeah, you have a much younger student than than the ones that are typically doing that kind of oh man. Wow. So so all of this to be saying is to be kind of bringing it back to play. So why is it so important? I think we're answering that, right, that kids detach from that and and in specific, play. Like not get off of one electronic advice to watch TVs, but literally go and play.

SPEAKER_00 25:41

We talked a little bit about trends. I've been in education 30 years or over 30 years now, and we see trends come and go. The one constant that stands out is that children learn by doing and by being engaged. And the best way to engage children is to spark their curiosity. And what sparks their curiosity is playing. Yeah. I mean, there is, I think it's undervalued and not we don't focus on it enough. It's not like you, when you do see your child playing in the park, and we're fortunate here, we have so many beautiful parks and open spaces. You're just thinking, oh, they're having a good time at the park, or physically they're being active. Are you really listening to the conversations that are taking place in the park when they're talking to other kids? I mean, they're negotiating, they're bargaining, they're learning life skills. So I can't emphasize enough how important it is to um take the time and really make it meaningful and I mean set out to provide children with these opportunities, to put them in these settings. To it's not, and that's I guess that's an easy way to remove the screen. Is you're not punishing them. It's not, oh, we only have screen time for 10 minutes, and then that's where their hyper focus comes. Like they want that iPad for those 10 minutes. Instead of focusing on that, let's focus on keeping them busy, being out, putting them in places where they can have these experiences.

SPEAKER_02 27:25

I I I wonder about because I think sometimes play can look to adults as something unproductive. You know, you're digging in the dirt, you're just making a mess. But I think there's something to that very essence, that the fact that it is unproductive that makes play for kids so wonderful. Can you speak to that at all?

SPEAKER_00 27:48

Yeah, well, it's it's a low stress situation. Think about it. Like there's no strings attached, there's no objectives. We're talking about anxiety. Yeah. Like, what a way to reduce anxiety. They are in control of what they want to do. They don't realize, I'm talking they as the child, they don't realize that they're guiding their learning because they're choosing what they want to play with, how they're interacting. So they're they don't have to worry about anything else. So then they can truly engage and they're open and receptive to taking all this in. It's not um told even when they're in the classroom for so long. Like, and we do, and I think we're doing a great job as society in general at schools. I mean, bringing Rhesus back. I think there's been a big emphasis, and I know when I was in the school setting, we would not allow teachers to take away Rhesus as a punishment, because think about it, your kids that can't stay still in class are the ones who truly end up getting punished, and they're the ones who need Rhesus. So I think we're doing better as a society in understanding that and allowing that. But now I lost my train of thought of where I was going with it. But oh, in the classroom, there's so many expectations and so few choices. I mean, research continuously proves that children need to have a choice. And but does the classroom itself typically lend itself? It's harder for a teacher. You have to again be intentional about it and set out, I'm gonna give them for an assignment, they can choose what way to report on this. But that takes more effort and it's not the day-to-day. So the only time that they have that they're in control and that they can make choices is during playtime. Like at home, it's time to have dinner. Uh, you know, we have to take a bath, all these things that they don't choose typically when to do it, but in play, they do.

SPEAKER_02 29:51

That's such an interesting thing. And I just in my mind, and I'm not even sure what the question is here, but productive play, i.e., I've set this for, or you know, let's let's say making cookies. We're making cookies, it's playful, it's fun, you're doing something, versus you have time and you have a mud puddle and you have some rocks, and now figure it out yourself. There's a there's a difference there.

SPEAKER_00 30:16

The cure like I mean, just sparking curiosity. Yeah. And that's intrinsic. It one something grabs their attention and they're curious and they run with that. The learning that takes place. And then I think one area, which is easy if we're conscious about it and intentional, is as parents, as caregivers, to have good, open-ended questions as they're playing to ask the child so that you can guide it in that direction and make it even more impactful.

SPEAKER_02 30:54

Interesting. Could you could you give an example? Like, for let's let's say there's a kid who's playing with rocks in a mud puddle and they're lining the rocks up? Like, what would you want to do?

SPEAKER_00 31:02

The first question there would be what are you doing? What are you trying to build? And then based on their response, you're like, Well, um, can you think of a way to make it tall? Like, what is their objective? What is their goal? Okay. And then continue to guide them in that direction. Well, how can this be stronger? Is this a fort? Um, who is it protecting? What can we do to better protect what's the purpose of the fort? Okay. Anything they're doing, um, friendly competition to and that goes, we can that goes into again interacting with others, learning, and when they're playing games and they're playing with other kids, learning how to win and how to lose. Yes. That's a very, very difficult one. And that's a life skill. It sure is. How do we take it? I still don't like to lose. I know. The compet and then you do what the competitiveness is good. Like we said, everything has its benefits and everything has its downfalls. That comp you need that competitiveness because that drives you. But talking about depression and anxiety, how do we handle um letdowns? Yeah. How do in life in general? And there, those are learned.

SPEAKER_02 32:25

Yeah. Learning how to lose. I do remember that, especially as a young kid, because of course, when you're very young, you just you lose, and it's just that the whole world, like it's a card game for crying out loud, but you're so mad that you didn't win. And the I remember the lessons that came from that and the and the way that my parents talked to me, and they were always very gentle about it, but it was always kind of a circle it back around. And a lot of it was about, you know, there are other people here, and they're someone somebody who won.

SPEAKER_00 32:50

So how are you going to well imagine we we're still very big in board games in our house, and now we're playing card games. We found some new fun ones. But now that we have three grown adults, imagine how that goes in a house full of competitive people and loud speaking people. We had um a funny story. My one of my daughters, this was years ago, was dating someone, and he happened to be at the house. My other two kids had come home from college and we're playing a game. And for us, it was normal, and it's all banter and family-friendly banter. Right. But we noticed you take it for granted. His eyes kept getting bigger and bigger, and he was playing, he was speaking. So, and at the end, we're like, I think we scared him because you have all these competitive personalities, but but yeah, learning how to lose is important. I would always tell my kids, you know, everybody's great at something, nobody's great at everything. Um, I believe in team sports too. I think you learn something in team sports, you don't learn anywhere else. And my daughter came home, she would she made a competitive uh travel soccer team through the skin of her teeth. I was a bench warmer. I'm very, very real at this. And I was happy that she was in the team and was getting this experience. I was not that parent, my child's a star, she has to play. I was actually surprised she made the team. She comes home from practice one day, very, very upset. It's like, it's not fair, those words. It's not fair. It's we can do a whole podcast on that. And I'm like, what do you mean? She's like, the coach isn't playing. I'm like, okay, let's sit down. You know your teammates. I want you to list them all in order of who you think the best is, in order from best to not as good. And just do that for the whole team. And then tell me how many kids are on the field. I go, we're very proud of you. You made this team. Yeah, that's wonderful. But do you, where do you see there's room for growth? And that's where the lesson of everybody's great at something, nobody's great at everything. Right, exactly. And if you want to be in that field as a starter, then what do you think you have to do? Set your goals, measurable, smart goals. Right.

SPEAKER_02 35:08

Okay, so coming bringing back around to play, and uh how about the element of boredom?

SPEAKER_00 35:14

Because boredom is good. Okay, tell us about this. Yes, it could also be bad. Remember when kids are bored in in the class, like from the classroom education setting, your bored kids are probably gonna create um some sort of chaos. Right. But I do believe and I feel comfortable saying that boredom is good. Because if you let a child get bored and sit there with their own thoughts, what happens? They have to come up with something. That's true. And what learning takes place during that?

SPEAKER_02 35:43

Yeah. So how if you were talking to parents today about how to set up a situation where it creates boredom, basically, um, what what would be what would be some some ideas that that somebody could do at home? Or and I maybe not you're creating boredom, but maybe it's a it's setting up a situation where all they can activate their own imagination to to do something.

SPEAKER_00 36:05

I don't know if I'm gonna answer directly to the boredom. And I I think I've mentioned it a couple of times again, and I don't want to be redundant, but being intentional. And I feel that modeling as well. I mean, if you're and I see it with my neighbors, I think they're doing a great job, their young parents with their little one. Um, if dad is outside working on a project, they it's not like, oh, keep her inside because there's tools and she's gonna get hurt. It's like, no, it's intentional about it. Obviously, you take care of the safety issues, right? But I've witnessed how he speaks to her and how he explains it. She's a three-year-old. And he's not talking baby language to her, she's uh explaining and he's letting her grab the sander and having her do it and feel and I think those situations I mean the the benefits of that in the long run are immeasurable. Um gardening, like yes, yes and one interesting one thing that I would speak to is as a parent, you know your child, but as they're growing, you're it's always a discovery. Be in tune with where their interests lie. What's important to them? What I mean, what makes them light up and then play off that.

SPEAKER_02 37:32

I can only imagine if you have a kid who is spending too much time on screens, they probably don't know what they like to do, but which is where a place like the children's museum comes in so beautifully. Um so maybe if if we're if somebody's listening who's like, my gosh, I feel like you're talking about my kid. I feel like I'm there's too much screen time, I don't know what to do. Uh, I guess this would be a really good call to action to say, give it a try, get put the leave the screens in the car and come into the children's museum and just play.

SPEAKER_00 38:02

Please, please, please come visit us. Um we are, I do want to share this because we do have an admission cost and we understand with how the economy is. And if you have three kids and I mean it gets expensive, we are very, very big in making sure that everybody has access to the museum. Um, we are very excited. We partnered with the Southwest Libraries and a ton of our libraries in Meridian, Boise. I don't want to leave anybody out. So let me peek here. The Ada Community Library in Lake Hazel, um, Cuna, Eagle, Council Valley, Free Library, Homedale, Middleton. So places that are not even close in proximity to us are now, they have um museum passes that you can check out for free. We have a museum membership. Each library sets how long you can have that pass out, and that pass entitles you to come to the museum with five guests. And not only is it free admission, you get all the perks that members get. So we open from nine to ten just for members. Um, we have planetarium tickets are free for members, and we all we are always, we just have a new planetarium program. We're constantly adding programs. We run those shows during the week two times a day and on weekends three times a day. Um, so please, I always tell parents, I guarantee your child will not be bored at the museum. I can guarantee that they will have a great time and will ask to come back. It is a perfect place to see their, let them lead the way. You follow them and learn where their interests lie. Um, so I think that's a wonderful thing. Yeah. If you don't go to the library or don't have a library card, the second Thursday of every month is our community appreciation day. So admission that day is reduced to $5 a day and we stay open till 7 p.m. The only downside to that, it does get a little more hectic. I mean, we want to get in everybody, but then we have people upset that it's not um, it's a little more full on those days, whereas the library pass gives you the option to come whenever, whenever you want. Um, another thing that is very neat. I know growing up, for me, my grandparents were a big family is very important to me. Yes. And my grandparents played a very big role in my upbringing. And children have a different relationship with their grandparents. Absolutely, yes. That's the way it's meant to be. And parents are there to um help develop the child, grow the and I know grandparents are part of that village, but as a parent's job, you're playing bad cop and you have to set the rules. I think when you become a grandparent, I'm not there yet. Um, then it's like I did the hard work. Now it's my time to have fun with my grandchild and spoil them. So it's very, very neat to see the interactions that happen in the museum daily between grandparents and children.

SPEAKER_02 41:17

Yeah, it's magical. It's absolutely magical. Do you still uh do you still go out in the community? Like, do you still go out? Like, do you have the van?

SPEAKER_00 41:24

And we do. Um, and I have numbers, museum on the move, and I've actually gotten to ride along and experience it. We have our museum on the move that goes out to schools. And I don't think, I mean, we're very big on bringing the museum, especially to the more rural communities. We go to, we go all the way to Mountain Home, we go to Weezer, we go to Cuna, and we actually have a um a planetarium that we bring. Museum that's awesome. And it is so neat. We have our physical planetarium at the museum, but we have this portable planetarium. So the same programs that we do at the museum and the planetarium, we're bringing out to the community and to schools. And we were recently, I wasn't gonna share this yet. Um, so we do we do our museum on the move, we go out to schools. Some of it is funded by grants. We do in-house field trips at the schools, we do STEM um days, but we're trying to get to as many people as we can and be a resource as for and think outside the box. So we are recently discussing having museum on the move available for birthday parties. We're talking about boredom and entertainment. I know that sometimes you do bounce houses, or how cool would it be to have us come out and do a coding class or um just bring out STEM activities or have the kids do science experiments at a birthday party? So we're developing that. That's in that's in the works.

SPEAKER_02 43:03

Yeah. Oh, that's that's tremendous. I love that. I thought why is it that these like real experiences stick with kids more than something that they might watch on their phone or you know, a cartoon or whatever? Why is it that and when you hear about it, kids will they'll tell you the whole, they'll go off on a big long tangent about this, da-da-da-da. And it was digging a hole in the ground with a stick, you know. And why do those stick?

SPEAKER_00 43:26

Because we learn by doing. And that hands-on if you tell in the classroom, you're constantly trying, and it's very difficult in a classroom when you have 30 children to give them the tangible hands-on experience. Tell me something, and you'll forget. Right. I actually have to go through first of all, you're more engaged, it's more, it's a lot more exciting than answering questions on a paper. You're actually doing it, you're witnessing whatever the project is, you're witnessing the change in front of you. That's not recovery. Collection of facts. That's learning by doing, and that's how we all learn best.

SPEAKER_02 44:05

Yeah. Okay, so shifting gears a little bit. I and this is not to shame parents. I I hope that if you're listening and you're beginning to feel shame, stop. Please don't feel shame.

SPEAKER_00 44:17

My kids here talking about me, they would throw me my body.

SPEAKER_02 44:20

We've both shared stories. We know that. So so it's not, it's not that I I want to dig in and have anybody feel badly. But what do you think that parents, well-meaning parents, are getting wrong right now?

SPEAKER_00 44:33

I just think life is so hectic and we're all balancing so much, regardless of what stage of life you're in. And it's easy to get drawn into the rut and the negativity and just go through trying to make it to the day. So um instead of thinking what they're getting wrong, what I would encourage parents, and I'm gonna say the word again so that it sticks, is be intentional. The fact if they're listening to this and want to do something, this is important. I mean, the positive effects of it will are long-lasting. I think as parents, we all, I mean, as a parent, your children are your biggest and most prized possession, and we all want to do what's best for them. I mean, I think this is important for 99% of the population. So just be intentional. Take some time to think about this. Plan this out. A couple minutes. If you just if you make it a habit, if you start little by little and it becomes part of your daily life and you make it a habit, then it's easier to continue. And you will feel great about yourself, even when we mess up and we're the bad parent. And we had to do that. It's gonna happen regardless. My parent the other day said, I I became I'm the worst parent today. By mistake, I threw away my child's drawing. I didn't realize that. And I picked up and they came to me with tears and said, I you hurt my feelings. So we all I mean But even that's a lesson. The way that the parents react to it and they show it. When we we all make mistakes and when we're wrong, we accept responsibility, we learn from it and we move forward. So absolutely. But I'm thinking just this is truly, truly important now more than ever. I feel I mean, we all I feel that we can go back and think of our childhood. What do you remember? The being out on a bike for a long time with the neighborhood kids. Yeah, you don't remember the specific toy. Do you remember your score in a video game? No.

unknown 46:56

No.

SPEAKER_00 46:56

No, do you remember when you ran to the park and you were there too late and got lost because you were coming up with a plan? How does she know that? Like, so so if we if that's what we can recall it now from our child to just think of what will be meaningful for your child to look back upon and and grow from.

SPEAKER_02 47:20

Do you think that being intentional as a parent helps reduce anxiety in the parent?

SPEAKER_00 47:27

I think so. I think again, at the end of the day, we always, I mean, at least I, so let me not say always, those are big words, but you reflect on what you did, what you could have done better. We put a lot of guilt on ourselves. Um I'm speaking for myself, but I just feel in general as a society, we're always looking at that. So if you are intentional, if you may have gone to the park with your child today or to the museum with your child today because they were driving you crazy at home and you were about to lose your mind, um, which is perfectly fine. And and that's what we're thinking about. And you're not alone. I have to say, you're definitely not alone. But where the intentional part of it comes, instead of thinking, oh my goodness, this child was driving me crazy. I was about to lose my mind, didn't know what to do. You can um look at it from a different perspective. Wow, that led me to take them to the museum. And it wasn't just to keep them busy. They were actually learning something that's going to have an impact that is gonna help with it's gonna help them in school, it's gonna help them in the future, whatever it is. Like take time to pay attention to what they gain from that. And it will make you feel a lot better as a parent, a little less chaotic, and reduce that anxiety or that guilt that we place on ourselves. Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 48:49

So you mentioned that to get into the museum, a kid has to have a parent or an adult, an adult, an adult has to accompany a kid. So if that's so there's gotta be a purpose to that, I'm assuming. Um so I'm wondering what happens. I'm I'm assuming sometimes the kid, the parents are kind of off in their own little world and the kids are doing their thing. But what happens when the parents engage in the play with the kids?

SPEAKER_00 49:13

Oh, it is there nothing warms my heart more and nothing makes me smile as much. And I have, I do have two stories that I have to share. And then when we were talking about screen, when I became the education director at the museum, my husband um was at work and shared with his co-workers and oh, my wife is working at the children's museum, and one of his employees says, Oh my goodness, that place got me through the pandemic. I didn't have child care and I had Zoom meetings, and she had a three-year-old at home. So she goes, I sat for hours in that train room with my computer on Zoom meetings. Mind you, the museum encourages not to have a screen, but we're not. We understand the world we're living. It's not, it's I'm playing around with him. I'm like, what? She was on a screen. But in reality, that's what we're there for for the community. And I'm glad I would have never known that had you not shared it, that the museum was able to allow that person to have some time of sanity because her son was so engaged with the trains that she can take a work of call. That being said, the flip side, we were talking about the parent engagement. I'm gonna talk about another story. We were recently at Green Acre's food truck, and we bring TARPs and all sorts of STEM activities. And the goal is, again, to provide these opportunities. There was no nothing. We want to come out into the community. Yes, we're getting our name out there, but we want to provide this. We want to be a resource. And I looked at one point, I look out at the tarps, and they're all full. Each tarp had at least one family. Um, and it was mom, dad, and children playing. The other one might have been dad and daughter, but all the tarps were full. And I just froze and took it all in. The conversations that were taking place. It wasn't that the parent was standing looking around, looking out. They were actually sitting on the tarp, playing with a child. I was, I mean, I would want to be at Green Acres every day and in every place providing these for families. The another funny part about that, there was we had some straw, like um building with straws, which are always fun. And I looked to that, that was at a table, not a tarp. And there was multiple dads and kids building, and I was like, oh, that's so neat. They were talking to other families that they didn't know. So through play, they're making connections and engaging. And all of a sudden, a couple minutes later, I look and the kids have moved on to other activities, and the dads were still building, and they had done like the biggest tower building. I I know because I had to put them apart to take it, to take it back. But I'm like, how great is that? Complete strangers that have children, the same age. I don't even know if they noticed that the children moved away because they were so, so engaged. Um, and on that, oh I just thought of something I was gonna say. Um, we are another thing that we are planning on doing, because I think that is so important in facilitating, we're telling parents do this, do this, and they're like, How do we do this? How do we take the time? We are creating a family-child game night. Oh, fun. At the museum after hours where families will be able to register, and we're planning teams of five or six. So let's say it's a family of four and we have a family of two, we will um combine them to make a team of six. And the activities are being very, we're really thinking them through that in order to compete and do this, there has to be collaboration between the child. There are parts that the child will own, and the parent will need the child, and the child's expertise and ability, and the child will need the parent to make that engagement seem natural and happen because it's it's so important.

SPEAKER_02 53:20

I I think you do a wonderful job of that.

SPEAKER_00 53:23

And Pat as as the original leader uh envisioning we just talk about her, and I do want to talk about Jen for a little. For those of you who haven't met Pat. Pat Baker, she's incredible. Baker is, I mean, she is a powerhouse. I can think of she. I tell her that I want to grow up and be like her, but I know I don't stand a chance because I'm tired just from watching the same way. A couple years younger. And I will share, um, we have a legacy lunch, luncheon when we honor somebody um that's made an impact in early childhood education and in the community in general. And we had to postpone that. It normally takes um place in the spring. We had to postpone it. It's October 21st at Hillcrest. If anybody, and there's still tickets available on our website, but that wasn't a good idea.

SPEAKER_02 54:19

It's a wonderful event. Talk about an uplifting, wonderful event. But that is a it's yeah, it's great. I'm glad you said that.

SPEAKER_00 54:25

So we had to postpone this. Uh and Pat comes in, we're we're working out the details, I'm moving this, and she's like, okay, but um we're supposed to have, I have this vision for a grandparents' tea, and we were supposed to have it in in the fall. So now we're gonna have to do it in the spring. But I'm traveling in three weeks, and I want it to take place before this. So we didn't, we had never done this event. She spearheaded the entire thing in my mind. You don't tell Pat when Pat has something in her mind, it is happening. Yes, and there is no stopping that. It's like, okay, how can we make this happen and jump on that, jump on that bandwagon? Because you know it's gonna be big and it's gonna be successful. So we're thinking, I'm like, but in my mind, I'm like, three weeks I have to sell tickets, 85 tickets in the museum. We've never done it before. Guess what? We had 85, and we say grandparents' tea, it doesn't have to be grandparents. It was a Matt Hatter's tea. Oh from the thought in Pat's mind to execution, three weeks. Wow. Super successful event. Again, the interactions to see the grandparents. We had like bingo, just the kids going through the activities and the games with the grandparents, and the feedback that we got from it was they were all like, are you doing this yearly? You need to bring this back. We had so much fun. So it will be back next spring. But she is just amazing. She had this vision. She was, for those of you who do not know, she ran several businesses and she was a travel agent, had traveled all over the world, very, very intentional. Yes. Is a good part of the become the theme of our podcast without planning it. Um, she would take her, she would visit children's museums in all her travels, and she takes her family um with her. Her grandkids are older now, and she looked at the Treasure Valley and didn't have a good place, an intentional place to take her own grandkids, and decided that she wanted to do this um for the community, and that's how the museum came to be. And it's such an honor that I get to that there's nothing to fix, there's only opportunity for growth and expansion, and that I get to um step into that role. Yeah. That being said, I do need to give a shout out to Jan. Absolutely. She is spectacular. So Pat was the founder of the museum, and she was the executive director the first two years. Um, Jan has a very funny story too, and we tease her. She had retired from nonprofits. She's done great big things in her career and comes to the museum when it's opening. She was actually hired right when it opened. She's the oldest and first employee, and she said, I've retired. I don't want to be a boss anymore. Her exact words are, I just want to be a worker bee. And she was hired at the museum. And when you're a true leader, you you can't control that. Leadership finds you. And she became the executive. She's on the second executive director. Pat um was our board chair. So she um hired Jan to be the executive director. And I've only had the opportunity to work with her. I tell her I'm so happy for this next chapter for her. She's retiring, she's being promoted to full-time official grandma. So I am very, very excited for her, but I feel cheated because I feel like I needed more time. She has made such a big impact on my personal life and my career in such a short period of time. So we're gonna miss her, and I speak for the entire wonderful staff that we have at the children's museum.

SPEAKER_02 58:16

That's awesome. Ah, it's such the good stuff. Um, really quickly, and I'm not sure. I'm sorry, we talked to my own. No, no, you're no not at all for that. Not at all. I um I just am hoping that maybe you can just quickly touch on some of the things that happened throughout the year. Things like touch a truck and uh night at the museum and things like that that are unique um experiences that you guys create. Absolutely.

SPEAKER_00 58:37

Well, and I'm gonna start with our most recent. I touched earlier on accessibility. We just had a career day on Saturday at the museum, and we offered free admission from 10 to 12. And outside, we had partnered with the children's entrepreneurial market, which is really neat business. Created by kids, run by kids, so they were in our parking lot. We had 37 vendors, I think it's age six to 17, and they're supposed to do the whole process. So cool. But we had by noon almost a thousand visitors in the museum. Wow. It was a little chaotic, but we were like, we could not believe. So I think that day, our attendance that day was close to 1100, and that just happened this past Saturday. Oh my gosh. And again, museum's a little busier, that's the downside of it. But if you have never been, it's an it was a great way to be able to go visit and and go in for free. Um, so we had that just happened this past Saturday. We do yearly events that are recurring, and then we do new fresh events. But um, we have our fun run coming up August 15th. I don't know by the time this airs, if it would have happened already. Um, we do have Space Day, which is huge, and that is September 12th at the NAMPA Civic Center, and that's a donation-based entry. And we will have phenomenal speakers, tons of hands-on activities. So, again, you want to engage your kids, you want examples, we're here to provide them. Come on out to Space Day on September 12, and that runs from 10 to 2. In October, we have our legacy lunch. In November, we're doing that adult date night escape room. Um, in December, we have uh I'm missing out. I know it's Polar Express, but I need to look at the name, the actual name of it because I have, I don't want to butcher it. It's not my it's gonna be my first time. Believe. I didn't even have it. Oh, I love it. We have Believe on December, and we also do our countdown to noon, which has a special ticketed event on New Year's Eve. Oh, that's instead of counting down to midnight. So we have little ones that are gonna fall asleep and you can't stay awake. That's so cool. And then, I mean, once the year starts again, we will have the grandparents' tea again in March. Oh, we have Blinko, which is a girl's night out in February, which always sells out as an after hours adult blinko game. That's very cool. So we're always trying to do it.

SPEAKER_02 1:01:21

So let's say if somebody's like, well, I how do I how if I want to stay in touch? Like, how do I, how would I get a hold of you?

SPEAKER_00 1:01:26

Come to our our website. We are we have a great social media creative person, and she's been doing wonderful reels videos. So we are on Facebook, we are on Instagram, and our website is very simple. It's cmidaho.org. And we are all listed there. And you can, if you want to send me a message, anybody a message, all our information, our calendar, our events are all there. But you can also link to our email. We are, we actually encourage you to please um contact us, give us feedback. We are here for the community. We want to be a resource for the community. That being said, I do need to put in another plug-in. Right now, one of the projects we're super excited that we're working on is creating an enrichment series for homeschool families. So I currently have on our website a survey. If you're a homeschool family, if you know it's a quick survey, I tried to make it as easy as possible. We talked a lot about intentional. Any program that we develop, we want it to be meaningful. We want it, I mean, there's no point in me creating a homeschool program that I think would be great if I don't have children that I'm homeschooling right now. We want what's relevant to people, so we do need the community to give us their feedback and spread the word. Anybody that you know that's in the when we have a big homeschool community in the Treasure Valley, so please, please, please, I urge you to take three minutes and complete that survey. Awesome. So that we can provide something in return that's valuable to them.

SPEAKER_02 1:03:00

Absolutely. Okay, so um kind of wrapping things up here, I'm wondering if, so we've talked about a lot of different things. Thinking about somebody who's listening and who's like, ah, there's a lot. There's a lot of things. If you were talking to somebody who maybe is a little overwhelmed at this point, but thinks, gosh, I'd like to make a step forward. What is one thing a parent could do this week, just one thing this week, that would improve their child's uh opportunity to be more connected with people and be more connected with their own thoughts and just to be a healthier kid in general? What would what would be one thing?

SPEAKER_00 1:03:33

I'll keep it simple. Think of one activity that you enjoyed as a child, a parent, something that resonated with you that did not involve the modern technology, and try that with your child. Start small in order for things. We can't go big. That's like New Year's resolutions, or I'm gonna go to the gym every single day and I'm gonna lose 20 pounds. That never works. Think about it like I'm gonna walk around the block today when I get home from work. Same thing applies here. Small, little small things. If your child is having screen time unlimited, think about slowly reducing that by half an hour if that works for you. Just little things may lead to big changes. Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 1:04:26

That's what I would that's great advice. I and I think that's a wonderful way to end this episode. Thank you, Ada Page, for being here. I really appreciate your time. I appreciate your brain cells because you do you have been doing this for a long time and you know this stuff. So thank you for being on the show and for sharing this with our audience. We appreciate it.

SPEAKER_00 1:04:43

I totally enjoyed it. I'm gonna be honest, I was very nervous and I didn't feel nervous throughout it all because it's something that comes natural to me. So thank you so much for the opportunity and for your support of the museum. Absolutely. And of the community in general, because you do big things. Thank you. Thank you.

SPEAKER_02 1:04:59

Hey, thanks for watching. If you or someone you know has a story to share, we'd love to hear from you. Reach out, share your story, and you could be featured on an upcoming episode. And remember, once your story gets shared, it will no longer be one that nobody knows.