Welcome to the Nobody Knowz podcast with Callie Zamzow. Join us for conversations with local change makers and hear the stories that don't always get told. It'll be honest, messy and beautiful. Touching and humorous. Slow down for a glass and pull up a chair. This is the nobody knows podcast. Welcome to Nobody Knows. I'm your host, Callie Zamzow, and I'm going to start off, first of all, just thanking our sponsor, Zamzows for sponsoring us. Thank you. Zamzows. I'm going to have a little tip of the week today, and, the the tip this week is actually how to get more tips from. So, you're the tip is that we have a newsletter. It's free, and you can sign up for it online if you just go to Zamzows.com and you pause for a moment, something will pop up saying, hey, would you like to join our newsletter? You can put in your information there and you are then automatically joining our newsletter. We send it out once a month. We don't spam you, but there are some fun, exclusive specials in there and little tidbits that you get nowhere else. So there is your tip of the week and how to get more tips of the week. So there you go. And I feel I'm feeling lighthearted if you can't tell today. And part of it is because I have two people in the studio that are friends of mine, and I'm very excited about what they're doing right now. And, this is going to be a fun conversation. So I'd like to welcome in the studio today, Kara Jackson and Don Day. Welcome. Hello to Nobody Knowz. Yeah, thanks for having us. Yes. It's great to have both of you. We we for the listeners, we often go to lunch together. My husband will join, and we have these fun conversations and I just. I enjoy you both so much. Both of your personalities are wonderful to be around, and you're doing such interesting things. So I'm excited about this conversation and sharing you, with the listeners. So. Yeah. Glad to have you here. Both. Yeah. Before we get going too far, would each of you take a moment just to kind of, Because you you are co-founders of Boise Dev amongst a whole bunch of other things that we're going to talk about. So do you want to talk about maybe just your, your road to where you are now? You're each willing to do that first, which they were married to. I was going to ask that I wasn't, I wasn't I mean, I know that you're married, so I was asking you do that. You didn't know that. Well, I know you're married, but I don't know how public you are about that. Oh, yeah. No, we're very public. I don't think people always realize because I kept my maiden name. But we're married, and so we run a business. We have a toddler together. We're always together. I, I mean, I don't know where you want us to start. I think probably for the sake of kind of the relation to the business. We can start with our first date. Yeah. So we actually were set up by a mutual friends mom. So shout out to Mary Beth Nutting. And she, she saw me at an event and asked me how I was doing, and I kind of had, like, just swore off men at that point, late 20s. We all have a mom before we do that. Yeah. And then she like, messaged me and messages dawn and set us up. And so that was almost ten years ago and we actually talked about concepts like BoiseDev and BoiseDev Eats on our first date. Yeah, it's one of the things that was like kind of magical is we had this like conversation about all the things we wanted to like, do with our lives. And, at the time, I was my little sister and I went home and she reminded me of this later. My sister did, and she's like I said to her, I think I had the best first date I've ever had. And turns out it was and worked out really, really nicely. And so we, you know, we both just kind of had like that entrepreneurial spirit. We were both bringing in for corporations at the time. And yeah, now here we are ten years in doing crazy things. That's so cool. I, my husband and I also on our our first date had a I went way deeper than you would imagine about just like our hopes and our dreams and so many similarities and even so far as to like in the future when we're able to, you know, contribute back to society in some financial way, where would we put our money? And we agreed on that. And so that's a pretty that's that's pretty intense, though when you have that. Yeah. You're like, oh I found my person. Yeah. Yeah. Well and I think like that first date in talking about these ideas, we had kind of like shaped kind of our relationship because even when we go on dates now or on vacation, like literally a couple of weeks ago, we were in Hawaii and we were in the pool and we were talking about business ideas like, so that's that's just kind of how we are. We're always talking about ideas. That's cool. It be kind of fun. I always think it'd be fun to be in somebody's brain, but it'd be kind of fun to, like, be in your relationship for a second, you know? Like, neither of those things. Trust me, I stay out. Yeah, I guess going to lunch is the most you want. Leave it at that. That's the. She can vouch. That seems normal. Okay, well, for I can't imagine there are people in this valley who don't know what Boise is, but let's just pretend that there are. And, could you share with our our listeners about BoiseDev, what you do and what makes you different because it it is definitely different. So we like to say we're local news, locally owned. And it's a it's kind of as simple as that. And little things start to orbit around that a bit. But we saw a need. My background is in corporate media in this town, and, I left after a long time there, a decade and a half or so, and, and I didn't intend to get back in the news just kind of happened and, and we we'll talk about that. But, I saw this need to have readers centered news and bring people information that they want to know. And, you know, Kara has been along for that journey and helped build and grow this and figure out how we actually make that be a business and make money and employ people. But it's really just fundamentally like what's what's going on in the community and telling people what's happening. And in a time where our society is fractured in a lot of ways, often along ideological lines, but in other things too rural and urban and, you know, you look for ways to connect. And for us it's like, well, people want to know what's happening on their block. If it's a new restaurant that's opening or a building that's going up, or there's a Sam's, those location opening or whatever it might be, people find that really fundamentally interesting. And we all do like everybody does. And so, it really just started there. And then our I think differentiator is we're the only locally owned commercial news outlet in town. And so all the decisions are made here by us and then by our team. And so we're not beholden to people in another state who we're trying to do things at scale for, you know, 50 or 60 different news outlets. It's just us trying to figure out what makes sense for the Treasure Valley and for Valley County. Yeah. And our tagline is is we put our readers first. And that's really true. You know, in every decision, we think, well, is this something our readers want to know about? We get a lot of pitches every day, and it's like, well, is this something relevant to our readers? Is this actually news? And then it also applies to our broader decisions, and that's how we've also built our products. So BoiseDev AM is our daily morning newsletter, and we built it back in 2021. And during Covid because you know, everyone wanted kind of that quick read of what's happening around town. And so we really use that kind of as our foundation and ideation and then building new products and kind of pieces of the flywheel of BoiseDev. Yeah. You can tell like just in reading it, that it's local and you can tell that you are thoughtful in everything that you that you put out there. It's I, I'm, I'm a it is such a thing. I'm addicted to it. I get so well. Thank you. Oh, we need you. It's so funny because I tease my daughter about being on her phone like, don't be on your phone, but literally, like, the first thing I do on the morning, I have this, like, ritual of things that I do. And one of the things is to pull up my BoiseDev and, you know, get the quick read. And it always is. It is quick. You can get just enough information. Or if you want to go deeper, you can always go deeper. And so I'm always really impressed with with what you're covering and how you're covering. And there's it's a good mix of things. It's not like it's not all super serious. It's not all super light. It's a it's a really nice mix. Yeah. And I think, you know, you talk about your phone in the morning and what people do or what people did. Hopefully we're changing the habit a little bit is they you know we all start with their phone. And it used to be you might wake up, turn the TV on, watch the TV morning news, you might get the newspaper off your doorstep and those things are falling away. And people aren't doing that as much anymore. And even the radio consumption is, is off. But people still had this. Like there was still the human need to know what was happening. Yeah, community. And we saw that and said, how can we do that? And, well, everybody's grabbing their phone in the morning and they're probably, you know, opening up a social app and they're seeing, you know, a post maybe from a local news anchor and then a picture of your grandkid and then maybe something hyperpartisan and then it kind of just seems to devolve from there. And it's driven by an algorithm that's trying to get you to stay hooked. And so that's not the greatest experience to know what's happening on your block, because Facebook's not going to serve it to you. And so for us it was like, well how do we take that. And the newsletter format was just a natural thing because we you can't fight people's behavior. They're not going to turn the TV on anymore. They're not going to go get the newspaper. They're just not it's just it's not coming back. And so but they have their phone. And so it's like, well, how do we capture that? And so the morning newsletters worked really well. And Gretchen Parsons, who, helped us set that up, she just, just left us. Had a little little girl, recently, and I, as we were figuring out the editorial mix for, like, I need something social. And I remember Kara and I were talking about this number, whose idea it was. But we're like, how about, like, a pet of the day? And I kid you not, I've been in news in this town for a really long time. A lot of time. It's the most popular thing that, I've ever been involved with. We've we have hundreds and hundreds submitted and, more than we can ever get to. I'm sorry if you've submitted your pet. We haven't picked it. And part of that is, is after we launched it, you folks at Samsung saw the value and sponsor that. And everybody who gets their pick in gets a coupon for some dog food. And so it's just wildly popular and it's a nice light way to start your day. And I joke that people open it just and they they tell me this like I open it so that I could scroll to the end and look at the pet pig. Now, we've we've literally had people tell us that, like the pet of the day is why they open the newsletter, which is which is something I love. Like if that's something a little piece of joy that you know you need to start your day, then that's going to be better than, you know, seeing the the negative stuff on Facebook or Instagram. Yeah. Isn't it interesting that, I mean, it's literally a random animal, somebody else's beloved. But we all are like, oh, like it's it's strange the emotions that it, you know, and some of them, you know, they'll have that little like blip about about the animal. And sometimes there's a little something in there. You're like, oh, survived cancer, like and like like, oh, this is or you'll see it in the foothills or you'll see it doing something funny, or there's a kid in the picture, or, you know, when my mom on my little dog of a long time passed away, like Gretchen gave me the grace that we put her in and pay tribute. And so, you know, like, it's just I think it's something that we we all love our pets. But particularly, it's just something that you know, even if the news that day is a little hard, there's something in there that just makes you feel good and you get on with your day and and start that off. Well, yeah, I love it that it's at the end because no matter. Yeah, no matter what you're reading, you get to the bottom and then there's always gonna, you're going to be left with some delightful feeling because you know who's not going to smile to a cute little animal. So yeah, brilliant. Brilliant idea. Love that part. Of course I'm biased, but I think it's great. Okay, well, so can we. You we have the three of us have talked about this a little bit. I find it fascinating. The fellowship that you and I, it was technically your fellowship. Yeah, it was both of us, but. But you both got to go, right? You both were a part of it. So can you talk to us about that? Because, by the way, I. I you we've talked about it. You talked you sort of like, mentioned the fellowship and then you talk about a little bit, but you've never mentioned how prestigious it is. That's what I just I was like, Holy cow, this is a very prestigious fellowship. Yeah. I mean, what happened is, I'll just say I worked at K-t-v-b for a long time, and I left looking for new things, basically, like three months after Carrie and I started dating, I was like, hey, so I'm gonna quit my job. And. And it was early enough that I was like, hopefully that's good. I really like this girl, but if it's not, I got to do it anyway because I gotta get out, right? And so I kind of cast about a little bit and started a kind of a small digital marketing firm, and I was like, oh, this is not as fun as I'd like it to be. And, had for a long time been tweeting BoiseDev items, when Twitter was, still as big as it was, and people liked them. And I was like, you know, well, I'm bored. I'm trying to get this digital marketing business going. I'm going to build a website and, Kara told me not to call it BoiseDev. She was probably right in hindsight. And now we're very stuck with it. I was like, well, what if you want to do more than development? And he was like, it's just it's just my hobby. And I was like, yeah, but like, it could grow. He was like, no, she saw the vision way before I did. I just it's just I'm like, I just need to do something to keep. And then that fall, I, again was on Twitter and saw this thing about this fellowship at Stanford. And I went, looked at it and went. So first of all, I don't have a traditional college degree. And so I was like, that's there, I'm gone. Except me, because I don't have that. And then, it I was like, not moving to California. This is crazy. And Kara was like, oh, you should just apply for it. I was like, you should apply. You don't know what will happen. Like, they might they might accept you. I'm like, fine. So I get all the stuff together. I was quite a bit and it is, you know, it is competitive. And I don't say that to be like, oh, I look at me, I stores and I look at it to say I was like, there's no way I'm going to get X. It's it's crazy. And so submitted. I was like in like November and then it takes several months, but you don't hear anything. And then in February they're like, hey, we'd like you to come down to Palo Alto and come to the campus. And I was like, I'm not doing this. The digital marketing firm was starting to work. I just was like, And I went to and Karen, I had been just dating about a year at that point and I went to dinner with her and her friends Brittany and Ethan, and they all, are MBA, Boise State MBA grads. And we ganged up on it. They do. And people I look up to, you know, my wife certainly. But even that Brittany Ethan like I look up to them and and they were like, well, you'd be crazy not to do this. Her friend Brittany kind of has a should I do a Brittany that day? You'd be crazy not to do this, that kind of thing. And I was like, all right, all right, all right. And so I was like, all right, fine, I'll go for the interview. Still being like, I'm not moving to California. Like, this is insane. And then was fortunate enough to be selected and was like, oh, no. And I had this thing of a fairly serious girlfriend at that point who had a job. And the wonderful thing, the wonderful and sometimes challenging thing about the fellowship is, you can bring a partner, spouse, domestic partner, girlfriend, boyfriend, whatever it might be with you, and they get a lot of the same benefits. It's not exactly the same because it's not a journalism. But like, you know, you get they get to come. But I didn't know if that's an accurate one to do. And so I was like, hey, do you, do you want to and you can take this. Yeah. And I thought about it for a bit and then, you know, I, I love education. I had I finished my MBA a few years before that, and I started looking around at all the different programs I could be a part of at Stanford for a year. And so I was like, well, why not? Like, you don't know what you're going to learn or what other opportunities that's going to lead to. So I quit my corporate job. You know, that study income when you're late, 29, 30 years old. And, yeah, we we rented out both of our houses and we moved down to Palo Alto. We packed up our dogs and moved down to Palo Alto for a year. And it was it's a really challenging year. There's a lot of uncertainty. And we were like learning how to live together and we'd never live with another person, let alone each other. Yeah. But it was also like, I think this year that really broadened our horizons. It's when we built the basic base business model for BoiseDev. It's when I kind of built out a an idea for BoiseDev Eats. And we learned a lot of different, you know, things in the business school at their school for design thinking, all of these things. So it was a really tremendous opportunity. Yeah. I can only imagine, like, I wish I could do it again. We jokingly call it mid-career retirement because we got to go and, they paid us. It was just it was modest, especially with the cost of living down there. But they paid us to be there. We got to take classes. We did not have to do homework or take tests. We audited the course of the classes, so that was fun. They they basically forced us to, to do something, athletic. We took three trimesters of golf, and neither of us can. We still can't. Golf tournaments. Tiger woods at Stanford. Great. But I care. At Stanford, not so much. It was good for us. And like, you went outside and it was always nice. And you got to, like, sit at the golf course and like, pretend to hit balls for me and, like, it was just, I was beautiful, you know, like, it was a nice break in the day. Yeah. So we got to and and the design of that gives you space to like, think. And it's funny because we're, we're in a really intense time of our life in business right now. And so like thinking about that, I'm like, oh boy, do I miss that. And it was really special, I think just for the opportunity to be able to go and do that. And, and I don't think BoiseDev would be anywhere near what it is without it. And it's not that I can point to one thing and be like, oh, well, they taught me how to do this one thing. It was just that we had a year to, like, consider how we might make this work. Yeah. And and like the other thing that was really cool was the number of entrepreneurs and business leaders that come in and speak, not in the classes, but just have different, you know, speeches and opportunities. You know, we listened to Sarah Blakely and Jamie Dimon and the founder of like, bonobos. And so all these different jobs. Yeah, yeah. You missed Harrison Ford. Unfortunately, I missed Harrison Ford. I like cried because I'm a Star Wars fan. When I realized I skipped a lecture one day in Harrison Ford, wasn't it like that is breaking? I got to play my viola and the symphony. The symphony there. We got to see Yo-Yo Ma perform like it was just this, like, year, I think of, like, boundary breaking and of realizing, like, how much potential a person can have, and you can have and, how much untapped potential there is. And thinking outside the box and thinking beyond, you know, what typical business models or typical life's look like? Yeah. You know, it's interesting. The theme of fellowships just keeps coming up. I'm currently in my very first fellowships I've, I was ever invited to. I cannot believe like the space that is created for growth when people have when they put together a fellowship and invite people to be a part of it, is. I still can't quite wrap my head around it like I we had this, thing where we were laughing about it just the other day, one of the other fellows and I, we're talking about the fact that, like, so so basically they're just are the female artists. It's women in their midlife. And so I'm like, wait, wait, so you're just basically going to take care of us and then like, give us, you know, feed us things and help us, like, see things, and then you're just you're just doing it so that we can just have, like, be better, like, that's it. And, and I just get to be a part of this, like, I can't. It's so amazing to me that that these get set up and we get to do them. And hearing about yours is just phenomenal. Like what a dream. What a very cool experience. Yeah, I often wish I could go back or like we were joking because Dawn was the fellow and I was the affiliate. And I'm like, well, now I could qualify to be there. So I don't know who would run our business for us, but like, I'd really like to go back and fountain hop at Stanford and yeah, you get in the fountains at Stanford. It's a very quirky place, and I think it was fascinating for us as like, we both grew up here in the in the Treasure Valley. And like, this fellowship was, was nine, nine men, nine women, nine, American fellows and nine international fellows and then all their partners and, you know, talking to somebody. And one of our fellows was from China, and, one was from Russia and one's from Cuba. And so hearing the challenges that they face, not just in journalism, but in their lives, broadens, I think, what your brain can process and learning from people. Not to say there's not fantastic people in the Treasure Valley. That's not it at all. But it's a different kettle of fish. When you're hearing somebody who talks about how, you know, they, had to they were light on food and so they would cut up pieces of a mop and season it and eat that. And, and so it, it lets you see that there are things out there that you just don't process as, a person who grew up in, in Boise. Yeah. And so it was really helpful, I think that way too, and just helping us know more about the world. Yeah. Grow your perspective. Yeah. I often so we we meet every other month. Our, our fellows and so I every time I come back home I'm like oh okay. Like that there's a whole new set of things that have widened my horizons and I. Yeah, it's it's wonderful. It's I think, if everybody had that opportunity, the world would be a whole lot different. Yeah. It's a very fortunate thing to get to be able to do. Yeah, yeah. Very cool. Okay. So going back to BoiseDev. So there seems to be at least us from just a reader, a balance of the things that you that you decide to share. There's a lot of things happening in this community right now. So how do you decide what you're going to how does that whole process work? Yeah, I mean, there's a strategy and I'll talk about the high low. And yeah, so we kind of have a high low strategy is kind of the general approach. So we always try to have a mix every day, you know, some low stuff which what's going in on the corner over there or like my story for tomorrow will be this, you know, Thai food restaurant. That's going in on Main Street here in downtown Boise. So kind of those lower level stories that are simple and easy, but things that people are curious about. And then we also, you know, really try to approach the higher level stories, you know, some of the challenging topics in our community homelessness, politics, you know, and politicians are doing things that they shouldn't be doing. You know, some of those more challenging topics as well. We kind of skip out the middle. You won't see a lot of crime on our site, and those types of topics. But car crashes, no car crashes. We don't really do Partizan politics. So we're not talking about a lot of, you know, Partizan things that animate the national discussion. You hear a lot about how national news, local news has been nationalized. I think if you watched most local news, it's a lot about what the white House is talking about. And, well, we don't ignore that. Right? It isn't our bread and butter, partly because other people are doing it and we leave it to them. We link out to them in Boise and so people can get that. But we think we can best serve our audience by focusing on things that are just very local and important here. Yeah. I also you do a very good job of I you cannot tell the reader cannot tell if you are biased one way or the other. Politically, I think you do a very good job of that so that you're not you know, a lot of times you can you will see that in certain outlets on both sides. Depends on, you know, who's doing it, but you can see it and you're like, oh, well, clearly there from this perspective. And it's tainted a little bit. It's a little. So it's interesting how you how are you able to do that. We just want to drive a truck down the middle of the road. Is wide as possible a swath as we can. And there are going to be people on the far left or on the far right who don't like. And we hear from them, and, and but it's honestly, it's fairly equal. Yesterday we had somebody pretty mad at us from, from the left and somebody pretty mad at us from the right. And it's weird. It tends to happen that way. People anger and they. Yeah. And and you're just like, well, okay, I'm not going to get everybody every day. You can't in this society. But I want to be palatable to the widest possible middle that we possibly can. And so if you're conservative you still need to know what's happening in your community. If you are liberal, you still need to know what's happening in your community. And if you go into a bubble and you're watching a program or a podcast or whatever it might be, that's for a specific perspective. I respect that and have no issue with that. But at the end of the day, you need to know if they're going to widen highway 16, in stages or who's actually running for office and what they think. So you can decide who to vote for. You know, what the policy around homelessness is. If there's a new Raising Cane's opening or an in and out like, those are the things you just kind of need to know. Yeah. And so for us, it's it's not as hard as it I think it seems. And we put a lot of care into the people we hire. And people are people have perspectives. We have perspectives. And but they all get that. It's not really about what they what we think. We don't run opinion pieces, which is an early decision we made. And so that because that content, the experience, even if it is fairly balanced and the pieces that are running, people see that and they go after all these opinion pieces that I don't agree with. And it hurts that just sort of pure information delivery that we're trying to do. So that must be written into how you guys, I mean, as part of your mission or vision or what that must be because you're human beings. So you guys, you have strong opinions and you have us about both of you. But it you're able to you're able to to keep that out of it. It's you're really not you're not really not trying to push your opinions out to people. So is that written into your values or nobody cares what I care? I think I guarantee you there's enough people out there telling you what to think and telling you their opinion. And so we don't we don't think that you need to know our opinion, right? Like you, we want to give everyone the facts and our community and let them make their own opinion. So it is court codified a few years ago, and we'll probably tune this up here in the next a little bit. But we we wanted to not establish a mission statement because I think mission statement is pretty obvious. Inform people. But we wanted to like, establish what our values were. And so I'll read it if that's okay. Yeah. It's not super long. It says we strive to be an innovative and impartial local news source focused on original and transparent reporting. We seek to give a voice to those without power. Our team will be accountable to each other and our readers. We will be gracious and tactful. We put readers first. And for us that kind of crystallizes like and there's certain words that are bold and innovative and personal, original, transparent. Because if we say what our values are, we hire people. We talk about the values in the interview process. We talk about that when they are, on board. We go back to them when we're coaching. Great. Grace is the one we talked probably about the most because people don't give each other, don't give themselves grace. And it's worked pretty well to sort of say, here's our defining sort of principles. Yeah. And I mean, in the hiring process, it's something we keep in mind. We look at, you know, if it's we're hiring for a reporter, we look at their sample work. And that impartial ness is a really important component that we consider. So how did you, let's go on a little off topic, but I'm just curious myself, like how how what was the process for developing that statement that you just read? Yeah, we did it off site in McCall. It's been like three years ago. And, Gretchen, actually led this session. We just found a thing online. It was like how to develop a value statement. It wasn't that complicated. And we did a whole process where we, like everybody, put like, what they thought our value should be on post-it notes. And like, you know, we had it all around the room and, and, we boiled down to sort of individual words and we all agreed on, like, here are our words. And those are actually the ones that are bolded in the statement now and then. Gretchen and I took it and wrote it into something. So that wasn't just like where it word where it works. It's kind of like. And then Cara and I talked about it. Cara wasn't full time in the business at the time. She was the more silent partner and we rolled it out. And, you know, it needs fresh and I think everything does. But it does a pretty good job. And and it's a reinforcement. It is on our website. People don't see it publicly, but it's more of a reinforcement mechanism internally. Like this is what we're trying to do. So you have built through BoiseDev. And it's taken some time. Obviously the first time you like launched it. So you get a few followers and then pretty soon, like the the tidal wave happens. I imagine that happened at some point where I was like, Holy cow. Now, like, how did you how how do you feel like you've earned trust from your readers over time. So has that been a an interesting road, or is it just kind of gone with the way that you guys have have conducted yourselves? And I'll be really frank, I think we're aided by the fact that, we it goes back to what we said in the beginning, the word local, and, corporate media has, opened a lane of opportunity, let's just say it that way. And so I think the trust has been somewhat easier to earn because people look at and go, well, this is kind of what it used to be. And there's not somebody trying to tell me what they think all the time. And and it's not to say that there isn't good work done in other places. It's not that there is. And we link to it every day, but when you load our homepage, you're kind of like, okay, these are things happening and you might not be interested in all of them. That's okay. But typically we think about like, you know, we run between 4 and 6 stories a day like we try and have mix. So it's not all Boise. It's not all development. It's not all features, it's not all elections. There's a little bit of everything in there. And I think people see that we're earnestly trying to do this well. And we write in a way that is that way. We've hired fantastic people, who are good, both good reporters and good humans. And I think the trust just has come with that. You can add to that. Yeah. I mean, I think trust is a difficult thing to build, right? It's difficult to build and easy to lose. And I think it's just been, it's, it's our values and that those show through in everything we do. Like a prime example is our ads. Like we could just, you know, make a ton of money off of just putting ads all over our website. And we don't do that. You're not going to see drug, you know, drug ads or pill out, you know, like diet pill ads on our website. You know, it's it's only local advertisers, because we want the experience on our website and in our newsletters to be better. And that's that ties back to trust. Right? Because we want that experience to be positive for our readers. So it's really it goes back to having every decision be to tide to readers being impartial, giving them, you know, the facts, no opinions. And then also, I'd say it's also, about taking feedback. And, you know, we get a lot of feedback and sometimes it's not helpful. Sometimes it's people, you know, offloading their bad day or whatever's going on in their life. But sometimes they're there is feedback there that, you know, we we need to make a story correction or we, you know, shift something that we're doing. And so I think that's also a piece in building Trust. I really try to start with feedback. And it's a hard thing to learn. And it's an easy thing to to stop doing. But when feedback comes in early, if it's negative or mean, I try and just take a minute, be like, is this right? And sometimes it is. And sometimes even when people somebody is being kind of a jerk about it, they're right. But it's easy as humans to get defensive and just be like Malik. And so I always try and take that and just take that in. And sometimes, like there's been times where people send really nasty notes and I'll write them back like, hey, I appreciate that. And like, you're right. And we made this change and be like, I didn't expect you to respond to me. I was like, you know, I'm not going to stoop to your level of discourse, but I am still going to try and listen to you. Yeah, it's such an interesting challenge. I actually just this week received an email from one of our employees, and they were offering their perspective about a promo that we were doing, and it was in disagreement. And, generally speaking, that goes through a whole flow of process, but they, they skipped and went directly to me, and there were a few people that kind of gave me feedback when I got excited. Again, I take everything seriously. So I and there were a couple people like, well, you know, whatever. And I'm like, no, not whatever. This is somebody within our organization who has a perspective and it we need to stop and listen to it. And once we dove into a little bit, we realized, oh, wait, we've completely missed, you know, there's a whole area that we completely missed. And if we hadn't slowed down and really listened and ask more questions, then we never would have gotten that information back. But but feedback is definitely it's a mixed blessing. Yeah. And sometimes, you know, you just have to like, let it go. Yeah. But there are also tidbits in there that can be really helpful in improving your product and and listening to your readers. Listening to your audience. Yeah, I always try to think about the person, not the ones who just lambast you and, you know, say mean things, but people who thoughtfully give you feedback. And it's hard for them to to say, I'm going to I'm going to tell you something difficult. And if they're brave enough to do that, I'm brave enough to listen. I guess I heard somebody yesterday email and tell me I should fire fire a reporter. And I was like, yeah, cool. Actually, you're mad at a story that was on another news outlets website. So you're going to email them? Yeah. Like I can't fire the other news outlets, reporters. I, I'm just it just as we're talking, I'm curious about your, your personality types. Have you guys like, have you done a little assessing of and do you kind of know where you each sit and are you more alike or more different or. I haven't done any of those in a while. I haven't either. We should probably should something we should have talked about doing it with the team. Yeah. It's good. It's kind of fun. Kara's definitely a driver. Okay? Her personality. I can see that. What do you think I am? And so. Well, what type? Which one are you talking? I don't know, I know there's so many, but, yeah, I'm more of the driver. Whereas, Don, I think I don't, I don't remember any of the specific personality types, but I think he's one of those people who, like, sits back like wants consensus is more thoughtful. I would say I'm like, right on the line of introvert and extrovert, and you're definitely more introvert, a little bit more introvert than me. So there's some things are were similar in some things where we're different. I'd say. Yeah, it's that's always interesting. I mean, my husband and I are polar opposites also work together. But it's, we have to really respect what each other is doing because we have our different strengths. But man, we fill in the gaps for each other and it's just lovely when we like, we have to pull each other back sometimes, like there's certain things that animate me, like there's a public agency who I'm very mad at and I'm constantly very mad. And it might be time to like, take legal action mad at and Cara has to help balance me out. And then, like yesterday, something happened and she is pretty mad. And I had to, like, pull her back. Like, sometimes we just pull each other back because it, you know, adrenaline flows and you get upset and you're like, I want a sued ex agency that I won't say here. And it's like, well, maybe we need to do that. But let's be deliberate about it, right? Like, let's not just do it like this argument. And I'm like, we had a debate. We should talk to our friends who's an attorney for like, maybe let's take some slower steps. Yeah. That's good. Good balance for sure. Oh good heavens. All right. So can we shift gears I would love well, actually I don't want to shift gears yet because I want to talk about the various things that I think it's really kind of been your thing, Kara. This adding on things like that eats. And then there was something I think I just saw in today's today's newsletter, I think, oh, we just launched. We just don't start today. Am I right about that? Yeah. Okay. I was like, I don't think I saw this before. And then you said it was new. So I was like, how new is that? So yeah. Well you talk a little bit about those. Yeah. So, my background is in marketing and in business. I have an MBA. Most of my career was in marketing and in the corporate setting, and, I actually left my. You know, marketing director, really good study, corporate job, a year and a half ago to join Boise to have full time and kind of start off all these new, different initiatives. So the first two that I launched BoiseDev Eats, which is our weekly newsletter about all things food in the Treasure Valley. I'm a foodie and my background is in agriculture, so I love getting to write those stories and kind of provide that resource to fellow foodies in the community. The second thing I launched was peek 43, which is our annual event and platform where we recognize the 43 fastest growing businesses in Idaho, and that's grown incredibly fast. We just had our our second event on October 1st, and there were over 500 people in the room. Yeah. Wow. It's, really incredible. Cara has done that. It'll be. We're moving into our third year. We've we started in one venue, outgrew it for year two, did it in the second venue for year two. And now for your three. It's grown incredibly fast. Yeah. And so I've, I've just been kind of growing all these things. We, we, you know, kind of say news is always our core. Local news is our core, but then what are other things that we can build around the flywheel? We launched Valley Lookout, which is our, our new site for Valley County, in February. And so I've kind of been this, like, side person who's not I'm not a traditional journalist, but building all these additional kind of pieces to the business model that are valuable to our readers and also hopefully going to help, you know, build our business. The book is another one, the events calendar. And so we're kind of just continuing to build all these pieces. Yeah, I was really excited about the things to do. What so what do you call it and things to do, we call the things to do in the newsletter for a long time, and I'm not sure where that came from. And so on. The websites like what we should probably be consistent and so, well, self-explanatory. It's a good name. Yeah yeah yeah yeah yeah yeah. And so the concept there is that it's kind of a one stop events calendar for the Treasure Valley, and it's segmented into different kind of categories. So depending on what you're looking for there's family friendly music. I'm trying to remember some of the other countries. Yeah. And we literally launched that officially this morning. Valley Valley Lookout has one as well for Valley County. But, you know, honestly, it was something we found. We need because as newsletter editors were trying to find events, you know, in BoiseDev Eats. I have a foodie things to do in Boise. They have and we have things to do. So we're searching everywhere. And there's not one place where we can go to find everything. I think I look on about 10 to 12 different sites. So that was kind of the, you know, emphasis for the pre emphasis for building things to do. Yeah, I, I may have squealed when I saw it. I was this is a great one especially I was like oh this is interesting. And I started scrolling. I was like, there's no way I'm right. And then and there were lots of things. I was like, oh, like, if you would, if you look here, you would never see this particular event because it would not be shown on this place. So it's really nice because it's a whole mix of all sorts of things. Really, really cool. I'm excited about that. Yeah. And businesses and local nonprofits and groups can also submit their events to be added to that calendar. Yeah, that's the one kind of fun thing. Funny thing for a long time is we featured every day for events or 4 or 5 events, things to do. And, we've never had to, like, wait for people to submit. They can email us, but we've never had, like, a thing. And so now they can actually finally, like, submit an event for consideration. That's really cool. So yeah, I think I'm sure there's like littler events that maybe people don't have a whole bunch of budget to get the word out. Fantastic. Yeah, yeah. Should be very helpful for the community, I think. Okay. Let's talk about the book. Yeah, I'm super excited about it. So tell us, tell us the name of the book. Tell us and tell us just the history of of all about it. Yeah. So the book is called Incredible Idaho Women 43 Inspiring Stories for All Ages. And what the book is, is it's a story about different, incredible Idaho women and each kind of page, two pages, one page is a story that we wrote about that woman. And it's not meant to be like biographical. Some of them, you know, talk about the woman as a child and then what she did as an adult. Others talk about a moment and that woman's life. And then we partnered with ten Idaho artists to create a portrait for each woman. Oh that's cool. Yeah. And so this has been a brainchild. It's been in the back of my brain for over five years. And so it's really, really exciting and rewarding to see this book come to life. Tell her how, I mean, how the idea came. It's such a great story. Yeah. So, the idea came back in in 2020. Dawn and I actually went up to Sun Valley that summer. And, you know, 2020 was a hard year for all of us. And Sun Valley had just opened back up. It's been a tricky year for me because I had foot surgery right before, like, the world shut down. So it was like a different level of isolation because I couldn't even, like, go for a walk, for several months. But it it hit July. My foot was finally healing. And so we got to spend all this time outside. And one day we wrote our bikes, we rented bikes and rode them, past what is it called, the, Festival Meadow, I think. Yeah, yeah. Champion meadow. Champions meadow, where all the bronze statues are of the Olympians affiliated with Sun Valley. And the most central kind of most prominent one is of Gretchen Frazier. And I had never heard of Gretchen Frazier before. And I'm an Idaho twin. I love, you know, I love to ski. And I love stories about women. And I was just, like, kind of dumbfounded, like, how have I not heard of Gretchen Frazier? And I was like, looking everything up about her and reading her story. And I was just so inspired by her. And I was like, well, why? Why don't we know about Gretchen Frazier? And there's, I'm sure tons of other stories like this of other inspiring Idaho women, like, we should make a book about it. And so we were sitting at dinner and I was like, well, what if like, we meet this book and, you know, Gretchen Frazier story was on one page, and then her portrait was on the next. And we started brainstorming other women. And it kind of just was this, like, inspiring idea in a, in a very challenging time, both personally and culturally. And I actually started working on it in the evenings. But then I got a new job. They kind of took over all my mind space and stopped working on it, but it was always in the back of my mind. That's cool. So this has been this has been going for a little while here. You've been working on it kind of in the back and thinking about it. And then, when we were working on our 2025 planning and like November of last year, we had all of like these potential projects we could tackle. And the book was one of them. And like I remember Don like circling it and being like, this is what we have to do. And I just like, was overwhelmed because I was like, but how you know. But yeah, so we started tackling it like in January. What an awesome visual of that being there. And you circling it like confirmation of this is we're going to do this. But what a cool, supportive, lovely thing. It's on two levels really. One, it's a fun thing to have exist and two, it's a business decision. And so you know we didn't just it's this isn't a charity. It has to perform and work for us. And we had lots of ideas. And I looked at it and I went, I want this to exist because I want it to be out there, but I also think it'll work for the business. So we did a book three years ago. We partnered with my dad, who's a photographer. It was called Boise City of Trees, and it's pretty good success. And, this is very different than that. But I was like, we've done this before. We kind of ran numbers and were like, okay, if we just sell this, many will make it work. And then as we went along, we knew we wanted to have some sort of charitable component to this. And we were like, what? What is that? Maybe like a $5 a book or a buck a book, or like we do something or we donate to libraries. And a friend of ours had talked about how the what was the Becky's figure about the budget for. Yeah, I mean, most, most Idaho school libraries in the state have a budget of less than $100 annually to purchase new books to replace damaged books. So there's there's a lot of literacy like stats in this state that, are pretty alarming, like that one. That's like, how do we how do we do something? And we landed this is someone from Stanford because, the the bombas, the socks. Those people came in and talked. And their model is for every pair of socks you buy, they donate one to, I think I think it's homeless homelessness shelters. And they're like, well, what if we did that? What if we like every copy of the book that was sold? We give one to a child and it was like, we're a nonprofit or a library or a school. And it was like. And so then of course, we're like crunching the numbers and like, okay, can we get the price of the book to work and like the printing costs and like all these things to balance out and to pay for the art and all these things and we're like, yeah, I think we can do it. And so and we've, we've pre-sold. We won't talk about the numbers, but we've pre-sold more copies of this book than we did the Boise book. And so the audience has taken it up. And so we'll give we're hoping to you say, say the number. We're hoping to donate 5000 books to, to Idaho schools in our program this next year. We have to sell that number of books. And so, you know, that's a but we're we're hopeful. And the idea for me I posted this on instead maybe you saw it the other day like Carrie had this idea and the, the fact that this the kids are going to be reading this under their covers. Yeah, yeah. And reading these stories and seeing this art is so inspiring. And it's because she had this idea, this passionate drive to do it. And so yes, it's a business decision. It has to make money for us. But, it's really cool. Sorry. Yeah. Well and we're, we're partnering with Book It Forward along with several other, the Idaho Library, Idaho Commission for libraries, and several other nonprofits to get these books in the hands of kids. But like Book It Forward is going to get it in the Terry Riley Health clinics and in the mammogram vans and in different places, that are rural and where, you know, a lot of kids don't have very many books in their home. And so the thought that they, they might have this and that, you know, there's all sorts of different women from all sorts of different backgrounds, hopefully they can connect with one of these stories and see what's possible for them. Yeah. And the stories are amazing. Like, and it's like people that you think of, like Barbara Morgan is, is an obvious one who went to space, for crying out loud. But there's, there's people in the book that you probably haven't heard of. And, one of my favorites is Betty Penson Ward, who is a journalist at the statesman for 30 years and ran with the at the time called the Woman's Section and features, is what you would call it now, and was just tough as nails. And, she had actually written a book in the very early 90s, a very different style book about some, prominent Idaho women. And so she's in this book now, and like, there's something that will speak to just about everybody here. Yeah, that's what I'm imagining is, the, the children who get to read the book because you've made it available to them they wouldn't otherwise see, and that there will be inspiration and you can't help them. You're dropping a pebble in the pond, and it is. It's going to ripple, and you won't even know how far it goes and who it reaches and who it inspires. And, yeah, it's it's pretty. That's a pretty cool thing. You know, that doesn't happen every day. Yeah, yeah. Well, and another thought that we had with the book when we were building out the list and trying to figure out, well, what types of woman do we want in this book and which which women do we choose, which is a really big challenge was, you know, the definition of incredible, like, obviously is winning a gold medal or starting a business or being a politician, being a trailblazer, all of those things. But there's also a lot of other things that can be incredible being a good mom, being a great neighbor, being kind, you know, doing your best for you. And so we really tried to weave that into the book is that there's a lot of different ways to be incredible. Like, not all of us are going to be good athletes. I'm not one of them. But we can all like, work and identify our talents and our you know, the things that are special to us and, and amplify those and be incredible in our own way. Yeah, yeah. Oh, gosh. I'm just my mind is going wild thinking about, children who maybe otherwise would force themselves to, to do something that they think is would be incredible by some other definition. But in reading the book, they will see that there are a whole bunch of definitions. And what a lovely gift. I would have loved that as a kid too. Very helpful for me. I want to save me some grief and like to see what's possible. I think is also hard because, like, I grew up here and you don't always realize what's possible. And so seeing, you know, like Cecilia Violetta Lopez is in this book and she, you know, she grew up in Rupert, the daughter of, migrant workers. And, you know, now she's a world class opera singer. And so, like, you know, your life can lead you wherever you want it to if you're willing to work hard enough and you have the right talent. And so I think that providing those stories to kids of all different backgrounds is really important. So. So tell us, give us the pitch on how people will get their hands on it. If they want to buy 1 or 18 of them and give them to the people for Christmas. Yeah. So, they're for sale now. At Incredible Idaho women.com. There's also a link at the top of BoiseDev.com. We have them for sale individually. We also have a buy three get the fourth free kind of deal going on, and then we'll also be selling them at a variety of bookstores, rediscovered books. I'm trying to remember some of the others. Yeah. The we had JT Bodega, and we've got a whole list called speak, speak. There's some statewide too, that we're working on. And yeah, so that wholesale list is going to grow in the coming months. And so we'll continue to update our our website with some of the, the local places, common ground coffee shops going to have it flying. So a lot of different places here in town and also statewide. Very cool. Well I'm excited. I'm excited about it. Very good. I'm going to take this moment to thank our sponsors. Am Zoe's and, I'm going to go a little off, topic here. Ordinarily I just have a regular ad, but this is, we're getting close to Christmas, and, and so we have a big Christmas event coming up at Sam's O's at our children location, and it will be on Saturday, November 29th from 12 to 6. And that is in the year of 2025. In case you're listening to this podcast at a different time. Anyway, I'll be a lot of fun. You can bring your whole family. It's going to be packed with a lot of fun. Christmas magic, if you will. They'll be hot cocoa. They'll be Santa. And Mrs. Claus there, and they'll be real live reindeer, and they'll be a barrel train. And families can just hang out and, browse the beautiful selection of Christmas trees and, just enjoy. Kind of. It's going to be this old fashioned, you know, holiday day. So, we hope that people will come and bring bring their kids, and it's no cost. We just want you to come and join us and, and kind of celebrate the holidays. So, again, that'll be Saturday, November 29th, from 12 to 6 in 2025. Nobody knows like ten old. So I will tell you, Saturday, the 29th of this year, our little guy will be there. He is train obsessed. Oh really? So we will be at the Chinden Zamzows. I am trying to help your ad here. Oh right now I saw her or his thing, but I'm pretty sure Christmas trees are going to be the next big thing. So all right, well, very good. We'll see you there. I will also be there. So, Well, we'll hang out. It'll be good. Okay. Well, this is the part of the show that we call sharing is caring. So if you're familiar with the show, then this means that, you know, it's kind of speed round. So I will throw these questions at you. Whomever would like to answer can answer them. You can both answer them if you have feel feel the movement to do so. So I'm just gonna start throwing them out. Are you ready? Sure. Okay. So first question a local story that you've covered lately that made you feel hopeful. I just wrote a story about mama's beef jerky. It's a business started up by this woman named Paula. Mayors. And she just won the Boise Entrepreneur Week Trail Mix award, which is $50,000. But it's just such a heartwarming story. She started this business. It's all family involves of her grown up grown children and grandchildren are involved and, they're actually using the the winnings from trail mix to get their USDA certification so they can be in retail. So really uplifting and exciting and just heartwarming story. I recommend you read it if you need one of those like lift. Great answer. Love it. All right. How about a local business or organization that you admire right now I'm going to actually I just namecheck them. I'm going to say it again, I love Jade's bodega in downtown. It's owned by Josh Davis. It is, the people in there so friendly and so kind. And what I love about them is they stock tons of local products. And so you get your staples. But like, I just always feel like our days are long and and we're doing a lot. I always walk to the post office and then I usually go into the bodega and I, I chat with Josh and Holly and, they make me feel welcome. And I get Christmas gifts there. Sometimes they'll stock the book like I mentioned. And so it's just kind of a, you know, cool little downtown jam. And I remember Josh once told me, like, because I asked because he went through the Covid pandemic, which is really difficult for that business because downtown was really shut down. And I said, why did why did you want to do this? And he's like, I just thought downtown needed this. And he's right. Yeah. So that's for me. I agree, we often will walk downtown and we always that's where we stopped. I've seen Clint there. Yes. Yeah. It's where we get our kombucha when we're on our walks. Yeah. Yeah. It's a great place. Okay. How about a book, a podcast or a person that is influencing how you think about leadership or community? For me, Taylor Swift. Like her. I've been a swiftie since Tim McGraw. So since, like, her first song, I mean, we've seen her live, like, three times, but, she was our first dance at our wedding. Yeah. Like. Yeah. Like, Love her. Quoted her in my vows. So, like, she's always, like, been somebody that we both, like, admire. But as she's grown, like, her marketing perspective, her leadership, how she gives back to communities is really incredible and admirable. I love how she approaches marketing and all the creative things like they recently did with the launch of Of life of a Show Girl. Like, we're trying to do a few of those things on a very small scale with the book, and we won't have 20 versions of the book now just for credit. There will be no cassette version of the book. There's not going to be a sparkly version. There's a little much lately, but there are good ideas. But there are good ideas there. And I just like, I just really, like, from a business sense, she's very, very wise. That's a great answer, I love it. All right. Last one, something outside of work that's been bringing you joy or balance. I think you're a little guy. Yeah. He's. He. We took him to Sesame Street Live a couple weeks ago, and he. It was like, what I what I imagine it was like when the Beatles came to Ed Sullivan in the 60s, I wasn't alive, but, you know, just. He lost his mind like that. Elmo was on stage, and it's just like, there's nothing better. Nothing better than that. Yeah. And simple joy, since he's, like, two years old, he's just discovering the world, right? And there's so much joy in simple things. Like, right now it's pumpkins. We took a pumpkin patch. Yeah, we took him to the farmstead a couple weeks ago. Right to. And like, he loved it. And all he wants to do is go back to the pumpkin patch and set up a pumpkin patch in our living room last night because he was asking. And I was like, I'm not taking you anywhere at 6 p.m., but we'll just hang out some pumpkins. And like, that brings him joy. And so I think it's that reminder that, like, the little things in life can be really special. Yes. Yeah. Oh, every age is great. That is a great age. That's a that's a pretty wonderful. And, yeah, just something new every day. Right. Oh, that's so great. I love I love your pictures, by the way. They're always fun to watch on social media. It's just that you guys all seem to be having I mean, obviously, we we post the things when we're having a good time. The tantrums probably. We don't post the 40 minute meltdowns. I mean, I might do that just to balance it out a little bit. Yeah. Like maybe then people would know what real life is like. But anybody who has kids knows. Yeah, yeah, well, I love that. I love that answer. Okay, now it's time for the question that we ask all of our guests. Are you ready? Ready. What is something that nobody knows. So we thought long and hard about what it would be, and we came up with something literally just this morning. And it's so it's interactive. So you have to help us. So, we went back and looked at our entire, history of most read stories on Boise, Idaho. We're going to pick out two. And I mean, you can you can guess what the top two, top most two read stories ever were. And one of them, I will give you a hint, was fairly recent. So, more recent it was this summer. We'll just say that. So one of them was this summer. So that's your first clue. And then the other one is very wonky. What do you think they are. Oh my gosh. Oh this is really hard I appreciate that. Yeah I know that. I don't think I would have guessed them. I the problem I think where I'm thinking about this is just the readership. So I don't most like most read. So what you're saying the most read okay. So that means that people like that, they have to read it and click to read on or now just that they like clicked into. So they viewed the story that they saw. Oh boy, I don't even I don't even know. Do you have any other hints? Let's see what's a good, beaver? Beaver? Oh, something that's coming to Boise. Oh. Oh, Hold on. Clint is going to be so mad at me if I don't. Come on. Bucky's. There you go. So that's number is was number. It was number two. Number two. Okay. Yeah. And, so that's a lot of those types of stories people are very interested in. And then the other one, the wonky one, is in. This will make you laugh, I hope. A story we did about the Idaho HOA act being set up. Really the most popular story ever. Like, who would have ever guess he loved reading about HOA? People are very passionate. Anytime we do an HOA story and we're actually very sparing because we don't want to be the HOA police. But when we do HOA stories, they always go wild. There's one of them, a story Margaret did a few years ago on an HOA that we've heard is being turned into a documentary. Really? Did you not? Yeah. Cheryl. Yeah, we aren't a party to that. But it was based on our story. You know, you wouldn't think, that those would happen. Maybe a little here and there, but HOA is come up all the time with people as far as like grass. Grass again. Yes. Can we get rid of our land? Can we not. Can we, can we have clover in our lawn? Can we, can we have chickens? Can we? Yeah, all of that stuff. There's a lot of HOA stuff. Yeah. I swear somebody emails us a story about an HOA, like at least once a week. We don't publish a lot of them, but we don't. We live in an old neighborhood, so we don't have an HOA and sometimes it's gray. And other times we're like, ups and downs. Yeah, the pros and cons, that's a cons, because neighbors can do funny things. And by funny, I don't really mean funny. No, like paint their house pink. Yeah. Bingo. Bingo. There's a whole thing in our neighborhood with a, a Sasquatch that was put up on somebody's side of their house and, you know, it's perfectly fine, Sasquatch. But what I've hear from the neighbors is we are not a Sasquatch community. Oh, wow. So I'm like, really? I'm not sure. We live on the second branch. Like, I don't think we've got a thing, but that's where I grew up. I that's Sasquatch country. I think so, too. But, you know, you could have a Sasquatch, you know, sighting on Hillcrest. I don't know, Lake on the golf course. He he went to high school. Yeah, I could see it. He might want to hit nine, nine holes, too, like you don't. Because you're discriminating, right? You're exactly right. I'm going to put that memo out to the neighbors. You guys, thank you for being here. This has been a lovely conversation. Really fun. Fun to have friends in the studio and just be, you know, having our usual conversation but doing it in front of microphones. I appreciate you both being here. Thank you. Oh, we appreciate you. Thank you. Yeah, absolutely. And we're going to do lunch soon. I'm assuming Clint's really bummed out he's missed out on this I think next room we should have just get to the fourth chair. We should have think about that next time. Well thank you again for joining us. Really appreciate it. And good luck with everything. I just I love everything you're doing and and I will continue to follow you. So this is really wonderful. Okay. If you enjoyed today's conversation, please follow the podcast and leave a review. And next time that you read a story on BoiseDev or see a new book by a local writer, take a moment to celebrate how those stories connect us all. Next week, we'll hear from another incredible voice shaping the Treasure Valley. And until then, thanks for listening.